Thread

Date of announcement

Paul Tavener, 11 Jul 2006 19:59:20

I think it's very likely that we shall hear about the new proposals on the 21st July for better or worse as this is the last day that Parliament sits before the summer recess.

Anyone else like to hazard a guess?

Teddy, 11 Jul 2006 20:45:21

It would be a typically sly move, although I'm not sure what the consequences of having the MPs away for the next 2-3 months would be? I'm not totally convinced that we will hear anything before the recess...

Author wrote:
> I think it's very likely that we shall hear about the new proposals on the 21st July for better or worse as this is the last day that Parliament sits before the summer recess.
> Anyone else like to hazard a guess?

Graham Marsden, 11 Jul 2006 21:44:46

Hi there,

Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk wrote:

> It would be a typically sly move, although I'm not sure what
> the consequences of having the MPs away for the next 2-3
> months would be?

It allows them to "bury" any stories that have potential negative
connotations for the Government.

By the time the MPs come back it will be old news and nobody's going to
be interested in kicking up a fuss about it because there'll have been
other things come up by then.

Cheers,
Graham.

Teddy, 11 Jul 2006 23:03:26

Another possible aspect/scenario to this is that many of our MPs will be very keen to be seen rallying around to support the proposals (rather like flies around a dung heap?) and will be denied the chance to do so with a 21st July announcement.

T.

Author wrote:
> Hi there,
> Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk wrote:
> > It would be a typically sly move, although I'm not sure what
> > the consequences of having the MPs away for the next 2-3
> > months would be?
> It allows them to "bury" any stories that have potential negative
> connotations for the Government.
> By the time the MPs come back it will be old news and nobody's going to
> be interested in kicking up a fuss about it because there'll have been
> other things come up by then.
> Cheers,
> Graham.

demolitionred, 12 Jul 2006 12:21:59

The HO has said it will be published before the close of business....on the 25th. That doesn't mean their proposals will be included...just a summary i.e. like the report the SE published.

http://www.parliament.uk/what_s_on/recess.cfm

Over the summer is the time the minsiters decided what they would like to see on the Queen's speech.

Since John Reid already has a lot on his plate, we may be lucky and this may drift to the bottom of priorities and not be included.

I think that chance increases exponentially if we use this time to lobby MPs. By getting them to ask the HO lots of difficult questions, our opposition will be evident.

*** This message has been edited by demolitionred on 12 Jul 2006 12:17:33 ***

Teddy, 25 Jul 2006 09:25:49

Morning all,

Well the 25th July is here and there is, apparently, nothing big in the news or anything on the HO website about this. Interesting to see if anything else develops through the day...

T.

Author wrote:
> The HO has said it will be published before the close of business....on the 25th. That doesn't mean their proposals will be included...just a summary i.e. like the report the SE published.
> http://www.parliament.uk/what_s_on/recess.cfm
> Over the summer is the time the minsiters decided what they would like to see on the Queen's speech.
> Since John Reid already has a lot on his plate, we may be lucky and this may drift to the bottom of priorities and not be included.
> I think that chance increases exponentially if we use this time to lobby MPs. By getting them to ask the HO lots of difficult questions, our opposition will be evident.

demolitionred, 25 Jul 2006 10:21:22

If we see nothing today, I'll contact and ask them what is happening.

I think Graham's Freedom of information request period ends today as well.

Teddy, 25 Jul 2006 10:28:42

Presumably, there is nothing stopping an announcement being made during the recess? Just that this would represent yet another procrastination on their part...long may it continue!!

Author wrote:
> If we see nothing today, I'll contact and ask them what is happening.
> I think Graham's Freedom of information request period ends today as well.

Graham Marsden, 25 Jul 2006 13:29:07

Hi there,

demolitionred@yahoo.com wrote:

> I think Graham's Freedom of information request period ends today as well.

Mine actually ends on the 27th, taken from the date of sending of the
message.

Cheers,
Graham.

Paul Tavener, 29 Jul 2006 20:23:25

Remember it's 20 working days

Author wrote:
> Hi there,
> demolitionred@yahoo.com wrote:
> > I think Graham's Freedom of information request period ends today as well.
> Mine actually ends on the 27th, taken from the date of sending of the
> message.
> Cheers,
> Graham.

Paul Tavener, 29 Jul 2006 20:56:16

Author wrote:
> Presumably, there is nothing stopping an announcement being made during the recess? Just that this would represent yet another procrastination on their part...long may it continue!!

This is entirely possible, however the delay is significant. It may well be that there is serious internal conflict at the Home Office over this issue:

Minister - we want this legislation on the statute books this year, just do it.

Civil Servants - there's no way of making this work! The Home Office will appear as incompetant (again).

Minister - just sort it out!

So it's anyone's guess what the outcome will be. There will remain a continuning danager of some cobbled together announcement until the Queen's speech when we should find out if this is going to happen in the next Parlimentary session or not.

If it doesn't appear in the Queen's speech it will be a definite sign that the proposals are in trouble, although they might reappear in an altered form at a later date.

Graham Marsden, 01 Aug 2006 05:25:37

Hi there,

admin@ofwatch.org.uk wrote:

> Remember it's 20 working days

I just checked [my emphasis]:

Freedom of Information Act 2000:

* * * * *

Time for compliance with request.

10. - (1) Subject to subsections (2) and (3), a public authority must
comply with section 1(1) promptly and in any event not later than the
twentieth *working* day following the date of receipt.

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00036--b.htm#10

* * * * *

So that's actually Tuesday the 8th of August.

Bugger :-(

Cheers,
Graham.

Teddy, 02 Aug 2006 14:48:22

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5228140.stm

This story might be of interest! How dare the public stand in the way of the governmental machine...

T

Author wrote:
> Hi there,
> admin@ofwatch.org.uk wrote:
> > Remember it's 20 working days
> I just checked [my emphasis]:
> Freedom of Information Act 2000:
> * * * * *
> Time for compliance with request.
> 10. - (1) Subject to subsections (2) and (3), a public authority must
> comply with section 1(1) promptly and in any event not later than the
> twentieth *working* day following the date of receipt.
> http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00036--b.htm#10
> * * * * *
> So that's actually Tuesday the 8th of August.
> Bugger :-(
> Cheers,
> Graham.

Paul Tavener, 02 Aug 2006 21:20:24

Unfortunately I suspect that you will recieve a response near the deadline that says something to the effect of "thanks for your request bla bla, we need more time bla bla". This then counts as thier response.

On the brighter side I believe that it will be resolved within a month or so. It will be interesting to see what happens - they might claim that they intend to publish later in which case we will have to wait a little longer, but will get there eventualy, but I can't see any public interest argument holding water over with holding the information.

In the unlikely event that their initial response is late make a complaint directly to the Information Commissioner imediately. Whatever else happens we would then have a small stick to beat them with.

Author wrote:
> Hi there,
> admin@ofwatch.org.uk wrote:
> > Remember it's 20 working days
> I just checked [my emphasis]:
> Freedom of Information Act 2000:
> * * * * *
> Time for compliance with request.
> 10. - (1) Subject to subsections (2) and (3), a public authority must
> comply with section 1(1) promptly and in any event not later than the
> twentieth *working* day following the date of receipt.
> http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00036--b.htm#10
> * * * * *
> So that's actually Tuesday the 8th of August.
> Bugger :-(
> Cheers,
> Graham.

snowflake, 06 Aug 2006 16:55:25

On 01/08/06, Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk wrote:
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5228140.stm
>
> This story might be of interest! How dare the public stand in the way of the governmental machine...

This change is being proposed because of the BBC, the Times and, a
small minority of the public demanding information the government is
trying to hide. The government doesn't like us using its own laws
against it.

Still, we've not got long before they're out and we have a different
set of morons who'll try to bully in a different way.

Zoë
--
www.t-vox.org
www.nobmouse.net: My own, weird website
www.livejournal.com/users/nobmouse
www.catnip-radio.com

Paul Tavener, 07 Aug 2006 01:38:59

I hope your right - but the danger is that they will do horrible damage before they leave which would be unlikely to be repaired by the next lot.

Author wrote:
> On 01/08/06, Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk wrote:
> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/5228140.stm
> >
> > This story might be of interest! How dare the public stand in the way of the governmental machine...
> This change is being proposed because of the BBC, the Times and, a
> small minority of the public demanding information the government is
> trying to hide. The government doesn't like us using its own laws
> against it.
> Still, we've not got long before they're out and we have a different
> set of morons who'll try to bully in a different way.
> Zoë
> --
> www.t-vox.org
> www.nobmouse.net: My own, weird website
> www.livejournal.com/users/nobmouse
> www.catnip-radio.com