Another Pair of Exchanges with Liberty
Arron Fitzgerald, 24 Feb 2006 08:05:24
Dear All,
Latest emails with Liberty. Please let me know if anyone thinks I'm being too caustic with them.
Arron
P.S. When I first contacted Liberty about the consultation, they advised me it was being prepared 'externally', hence my reference to their 'outsourced' response.
----- Original Message -----
Arron Fitzgerald, 24 Feb 2006 08:05:24
To: Gareth Crossman
Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 8:26 AM
demolitionred, 24 Feb 2006 08:46:01
Given -- as I said a few days ago -- Spanner are having very friendly discussions with Liberty and their submission to the consultation largely supports the cause of BDSM could you please refrain from contacting them for the next few days...
I'm not sure your vitriol is strategically sound....and since it is not a backlash approved message I'm not sure you should be associating the group with your comments....
just my thoughts....
*** This message has been edited by demolitionred on 24 Feb 2006 08:46:29 ***
Teddy, 25 Feb 2006 02:03:44
If I may offer a word of unity here?
I am pleased Spanner and Liberty are forming common ground; as a non-BDSM person, I was very impressed by the direct and powerful response of the ST to the consultation. NOBODY should be criminalised for behaviour that doesn't harm others or infringe their rights. Neither the government, nor any of the bill's other proponents, have provided an example of an adult website where REAL non-consenseual activities are openly featured...
I can see that many BDSM folk might see the Liberty response as reassuring, but this is all about freedom as well as sexuality. It's a pity Liberty were not so uncompromising with their reply as the ST and, I agree with Arron, there are many issues such as "thought crime" and the pickle they are in over defining "consensual/non-consensual acts", where Liberty really need to pull their weight more effectively.
Teddy
Author wrote:
> Given -- as I said a few days ago -- Spanner are having very friendly discussions with Liberty and their submission to the consultation largely supports the cause of BDSM could you please refrain from contacting them for the next few days...
> I'm not sure your vitriol is strategically sound....and since it is not a backlash approved message I'm not sure you should be associating the group with your comments....
> just my thoughts....
zak, 25 Feb 2006 10:45:38
If the poster is writing to Liberty on behalf of Backlash then perhaps he
ought to hang
fire a minute: if he's writing to them as an individual then it's entirely
up to him how
hard he kickes their arses - the harder, the better.
Original Message:
-----------------
Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk, 25 Feb 2006 10:45:38
If I may offer a word of unity here?
I am pleased Spanner and Liberty are forming common ground; as a non-BDSM
person, I was
very impressed by the direct and powerful response of the ST to the
consultation. NOBODY
should be criminalised for behaviour that doesn't harm others or infringe
their rights.
Neither the government, nor any of the bill's other proponents, have
provided an example
of an adult website where REAL non-consenseual activities are openly
featured...
I can see that many BDSM folk might see the Liberty response as reassuring,
but this is
all about freedom as well as sexuality. It's a pity Liberty were not so
uncompromising
with their reply as the ST and, I agree with Arron, there are many issues
such as "thought
crime" and the pickle they are in over defining "consensual/non-consensual
acts", where
Liberty really need to pull their weight more effectively.
Teddy
Author wrote:
> Given -- as I said a few days ago -- Spanner are having very friendly
discussions with
Liberty and their submission to the consultation largely supports the cause
of BDSM could
you please refrain from contacting them for the next few days...
> I'm not sure your vitriol is strategically sound....and since it is not a
backlash
approved message I'm not sure you should be associating the group with your
comments....
> just my thoughts....
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Teddy, 25 Feb 2006 15:04:33
Agreed...
Author wrote:
> If the poster is writing to Liberty on behalf of Backlash then perhaps he
> ought to hang
> fire a minute: if he's writing to them as an individual then it's entirely
> up to him how
> hard he kickes their arses - the harder, the better.
> Original Message:
> -----------------
: Teddysmith2@hotmail.co.uk, 25 Feb 2006 15:04:33
> Subject: [backlash] RE: Another Pair of Exchanges with Liberty
> If I may offer a word of unity here?
> I am pleased Spanner and Liberty are forming common ground; as a non-BDSM
> person, I was
> very impressed by the direct and powerful response of the ST to the
> consultation. NOBODY
> should be criminalised for behaviour that doesn't harm others or infringe
> their rights.
> Neither the government, nor any of the bill's other proponents, have
> provided an example
> of an adult website where REAL non-consenseual activities are openly
> featured...
> I can see that many BDSM folk might see the Liberty response as reassuring,
> but this is
> all about freedom as well as sexuality. It's a pity Liberty were not so
> uncompromising
> with their reply as the ST and, I agree with Arron, there are many issues
> such as "thought
> crime" and the pickle they are in over defining "consensual/non-consensual
> acts", where
> Liberty really need to pull their weight more effectively.
> Teddy
> Author wrote:
> > Given -- as I said a few days ago -- Spanner are having very friendly
> discussions with
> Liberty and their submission to the consultation largely supports the cause
> of BDSM could
> you please refrain from contacting them for the next few days...
> > I'm not sure your vitriol is strategically sound....and since it is not a
> backlash
> approved message I'm not sure you should be associating the group with your
> comments....
> > just my thoughts....
> --
> If you want to share pictures, use the calendar, or start a vote
> visit http://www.smartgroups.com/groups/Backlash
> To leave the Group, email: Backlash-unsubscribe@smartgroups.com
> Report abuse http://www.smartgroups.com/text/abusereport.cfm?gid%3D32714
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> mail2web - Check your email from the web at
> http://mail2web.com/ .
demolitionred, 27 Feb 2006 17:08:27
I agree with you absolutely Teddy. One of the important remits of backlash is to defend against any attack on freedom of thought. I just meant it didn't make sense for two groups both purporting to represent backlash to be having two separate debates.
Rather I thought that since there is some common ground that could be a springboard for discussing our other areas of concern.